Optics for self defense vs Olight laser?

[oafpatroll]

I've been shooting irons for 35+ years and have, over the last year, put a bit of effort into trying out a dot. What that exercise has shown me is that it would take me a lot longer time to attain a level of competence that would make me confident to carry one for use socially.

[Bundu Ric]

I have replaced all my sights on my pistols with RDS.

Same principles apply for RDS vs. irons, practise.

On the pistols I use for comp I usually shoot dot only, less distractions and smaller aim and for SD I prefer the dot and circle of the Holosun 507 as it gives you a bigger reference point, and under stress I think this would be beneficial. This is however just my opinion. Oh, and you can run this sight dot only, circle only or dot and circle.

With old eyes, will I go back to irons, hell no, tech is there to make things better and it does when you get proficient with it.

[FuDog]

My 2 cents - As someone returning to shooting after almost 20 years away from it; it didn't feel difficult to transition to an RDS as I simply haven't been repetitively and consistently using iron sights. I think this is one of the key issues - if you've trained for years with iron sights and simply don't have the time, inclination or bandwidth to retrain yourself, then it doesn't seem sensible to go down that road.

Having said that, I am one of those unlucky souls (and there are many of us out there. ) who's eyes just can't do the iron sight thing anymore. If you are presbyopic, 3 focal planes is just not going to happen. With a red dot you're focused on the target; you simply superimpose the dot on what you're looking at.

These guys like Massad Ayoob and Ken Hackathorn come from a time before RDS's and have mastered that approach. It's not a right or wrong proposition.

Reflex sights are however the way things are going - military and LE has shown that.

Like so many things, binary think is not the answer to this question. Right tool for the job and all that :)

As a counterpoint, while I have never been in an SD situation (and hope to never be), it does appear that controlled sighting application is not really likely. Active Self Protection videos seem to suggest that reactive, point shooting is going to be what happens anyway.

[Meteor]

Look up reviews showing how far a laser is visible in daylight outside. It is about 30-40m. Also ask yourself why people keep on getting green lasers when there is so much green outside

...for house clearing...I do not think there is a better option


But this is all secondhand info. I don't have any experience with them or dots.

[bluefronted]

During a couple of our club night shoots there was one guy with a weapon mounted lazer. In real life it didn't work for any of us who played with it. It doesn't help you to identify your target, it doesn't help you to shoot faster or more accurate. It might be a good intimidation tool that is all. Ok and it shows you how much you shake.
If you can opperate your gun fast and accurate during the day, then get a decent edc flashlight first and after that a weapon mounted light. And then you practice with it. Why first a handheld light: you don't want to light up your wife, kid, dog etc with a wml when you hear a bump at night.

I like the part of the hand shaking .

When I use an optic on my 19x I see the " Shakes"

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[FNBROWNING]

For most it is going to be point and shoot within spitting distance and in the dark. Focus will be on scanning shapes and shadows. As I get older I become ever more convinced that the fit to your hand and natural pointability in orders of magnitude outweighs any benefit that different sights might confer. To this end I wish I could get my hands on another mint MK3 High Power.

[Cbotha15]

If you don't shoot production optics then don't bother...it takes many hours of training and practice to shoot a optic ...I think in most sd scenarios I won't even have time to turn it on....this is just my personal observation...

get an optic that stays on permanently or one that has a shake awake feature. It also takes practice to master iron sights so...pick your poison.

[ZK1]

Here's an example of RDS vs Irons.........just an example doesn't necessarily translate to real world scenario's.

But I have been running my RDS for I think it's about 2 years now. It makes targets further out way easier because you can target focus.

Also did a test with a new shooter also Gen5 G19 like mine, shot the "Dickens Drill" or a variation of that, at about 35m and 12 shots in 15 seconds. First had the shooter shoot his own pistol and got 2 out of 12, then took my gun with the RDS and straight away got 8 out of 12.

You need to train anyways to be competent, so it's really not that much training to get your draw and presentation right, irons or RDS.

[Heath Robinson]

Nobody is arguing that optics don't make long-range shooting easier.

But despite the Dickens drill being based on a real-life scenario, it is almost completely irrelevant to personal defense in South Africa.

In my opinion it's folly to optimize your equipment for the 1% situation if that optimization reduces its' effectiveness for the more common scenarios.

There is no denying that an optic is less robust and less reliable than good irons, and I am convinced irons are as fast or faster for getting acceptable accuracy at short range from the draw, especially for people who really don't practice quite enough (which I think is 90% of us).

[lokx]

In my opinion it's folly to optimize your equipment for the 1% situation if that optimization reduces its' effectiveness for the more common scenarios.

There is no denying that an optic is less robust and less reliable than good irons, and I am convinced irons are as fast or faster for getting acceptable accuracy at short range from the draw, especially for people who really don't practice quite enough (which I think is 90% of us).

How does it reduce effectiveness ?


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