Advice Please

**J_Bay** · 06-07-2009, 08:46

Hi Guys,

I'm new on here as you can tell. I was recently refered here and I must say, this site is full of
usefull stuff.

I have a question for anyone who can answer it, relating to the issue of a gun licenced for self defence,
and one licenced for sporting purposes.

What I want to know is, if you have a handgun licenced for sporting purposes, and you where to use this
in self defence, would you then be breaking the law?

I know the act says that a gun that is legally licenced can be used for "any lawful purpose", but would this
then cover using a gun that is licenced for sport in self defence?

I don't personally own one yet, but I am thinking of getting a .45, wich is a calibre I have always loved. I was
thinking about a Taurus PT 1911 in stainless steel, because it's atleast affordable. Since it's a .45 I was hoping to
circumvent the trouble with motivation by joining a practical pistol club, because I want to take part in that sport.

The dilema is that if I got the licence on the grounds that I need it to take part in a sport, would I still legally be
able to use it for self defence, wich is also a reason that I want it, seeing that I travel a long way at night to get home,
and you do go through some less than desirable areas some times.

Any help would be greatly appreciated guys.

Yours in Shooting,

Jared

**Sean Murphy** · 06-07-2009, 09:36

It would be perfectly legal for you to use the firearm for self defence.

Sean.

**shooter** · 06-07-2009, 09:47

Jared, go look in the legal issues sub-forum, as this has been discussed quite a few times there. As you'll see, opinions will vary on this subject :D

DS · 06-07-2009, 11:21

The FCA stipulates that you may use your licenced firearm for any legal purpose where it is safe to do so. There is no stipulation that indicates that you may not use a Sport Shooting licenced pistol SD.

Do a search and read all the posts about the matter and decide for yourself.

**Brendank** · 06-07-2009, 20:34

Originally Posted by J_Bay

Hi Guys,

I'm new on here as you can tell. I was recently refered here and I must say, this site is full of
usefull stuff.

I have a question for anyone who can answer it, relating to the issue of a gun licenced for self defence,
and one licenced for sporting purposes.

What I want to know is, if you have a handgun licenced for sporting purposes, and you where to use this
in self defence, would you then be breaking the law?

I know the act says that a gun that is legally licenced can be used for "any lawful purpose", but would this
then cover using a gun that is licenced for sport in self defence?

I don't personally own one yet, but I am thinking of getting a .45, wich is a calibre I have always loved. I was
thinking about a Taurus PT 1911 in stainless steel, because it's atleast affordable. Since it's a .45 I was hoping to
circumvent the trouble with motivation by joining a practical pistol club, because I want to take part in that sport.

The dilema is that if I got the licence on the grounds that I need it to take part in a sport, would I still legally be
able to use it for self defence, wich is also a reason that I want it, seeing that I travel a long way at night to get home,
and you do go through some less than desirable areas some times.

Any help would be greatly appreciated guys.

Yours in Shooting,

Jared

Welcome Jared! Glad you joined! ;)
Good debate on Sealine btw, you will learn alot here.
As the guys have said, not an issue using a sporting handgun for SD.

Regarding your choice, Taurus is a good option, but the model I call into question (for SD purposes).
If you want a .45ACP 1911 then license it as Section 15 (occasional sport & hunting use).

Rather look at a Glock 21 (.45ACP) or even a Glock 22 (.40S&W), greater mag capacity, superior reliability.
Carry ammo availability in .40S&W is very good at moment.
Also please don't discount 9x19, but keep in mind carry ammo availability isn't good at moment (will change though).

**J_Bay** · 07-07-2009, 08:34

Thanks for the reply Brendan.

You're right on the point of magazine capacity, but I don't see myself ever
owning a Glock pistol. No question that they are fine quality weapons, the
problem is that I find nothing appealing about a "plastic" gun.

To me, the looks and finish a gun are just as important as the magazine capacity,
and things like that. One could get extended mags for the Taurus, but that makes
it a bit unwieldy. I'd rather go cocked and locked with it, and have a round up in the
chamber and 8 in the mag, aswell as carry the back up magazine wich comes with it.

My feelings are the same with the 9 X 19, they have enourmous magazine capacity, they
lack serious fight stopping power(U.S military special forces refuse to use them, albeit they
are now the standard issue, they all revert back to the .45ACP).

My feeling is that I'd rather have 9 230 grain Federal Hydrashoks, than 19 9mm hollow points.

Surely there will be those that disagree, but that is the beauty of our sport and pass time. Guns
are like cars, they pretty much all do the same thing, but everyone has a favourite!

Regarding the reliability of the Taurus, I'm not completely convinced that the Glock has that much over it.
I wouldn't say the same thing about all their guns, but this particular one(PT1911) has been tested time and
again by large American publications, some of them firing more than 1000 rounds in a weekend testing session
and very few have reported failiures of any kind. They would certainly harp about it if they did because this gun
is giving their own companies like Springfield armory and Kimber a very hard time in terms of 1911 sales.

Thanks for all the input, and I welcome all suggestions!!!

**SSP** · 07-07-2009, 09:08

I tend to discount gun magazine reviews, with a few exceptions, as bull. These writers get the gun and ammo for free. If they give a bad review the magazine loses advertising revenue. SWAT magazine is the only mag I know of that has told a manufacturer to get bent when they threatened to take away an advertising contract.

I put a fair amount of stock in what the serious guys on forums like 10-8 and M4carbine have to say.

Generally, they have poor things to say about the Taurus 1911.

If you are really that insecure about your calibre choice and refuse to join the 20th century look at a Sig 220. Same capacity, more reliable. 1911's are like Alfa Romeo's every gun nut needs one. But not to drive every day.

**Thorkind** · 07-07-2009, 09:27

Originally Posted by J_Bay

My feelings are the same with the 9 X 19, they have enourmous magazine capacity, they
lack serious fight stopping power(U.S military special forces refuse to use them, albeit they
are now the standard issue, they all revert back to the .45ACP).

My feeling is that I'd rather have 9 230 grain Federal Hydrashoks, than 19 9mm hollow points.

Thanks for all the input, and I welcome all suggestions!!!

Welcome to the site J Bay. At the risk of starting another caliber war, please remember that service caliber handguns are poor terminal performers. I refer to an incident posted on another recent thread WRT a bad guy shot multiple times with 230gr Hydra-shok .45's with no immediate result until a headshot was taken.

http://www.gunsite.co.za/forum/index...4.msg36968#new

ABHM and Ikor will have more info WRT US Special Forces handgun usage. However, the 9x19 platform is currently in use with US Navy SEALs (Sig P226), Rangers (M9), Special Forces Operational Detachments (M9), Marine Recon (M9) etc. Yes, there are units that use 1911's and other specialized handguns, but the majority use 9x19. The skill of the operator is far more important than the difference between .45 & 9x19. Can 9x19 do the job? Read the article and decide for yourself:

http://socnet.com/showthread.php?t=70111

**ikor** · 07-07-2009, 09:41

Believe it or not, one hugely respected and well known US SpecOps unit is currently using...gasp...Glock 22's...two of which are issued to each trooper. The 1911s have generally not stood up well to the continued huge amounts shooting done by most such specialized units, but a couple do still use them partly because for many missions they are only allowed to use ball ammo, but at least as much for the sterling user accuracy of the accurized 1911s over almost any other autoloading combat handgun that will take rough treatment.I freely admit, however, to being a huge 1911 fan and own several.

I have heard mixed reports on the TAURUS 1911 but the funky trigger block, etc. would exclude it from my selection process for a 1911 in any case. I would look at an older Series 70 Colt or if you can find one a new Springfield Armory GI or higher grade. If I had the bucks, I would simply contact Khumba here and get a Wilson...problem resolved even if your wallet is now flat. ;D

**J_Bay** · 07-07-2009, 10:20

I like the Colt 70, and actually my favourite one is the Smith and Wesson 1911...but that'll take some serious saving!

I guess with licences being so hard to come by, you have to shop smart...