Shooting until the threat is down: an example of modern training

[Andy44]

Thanks for your comments ikor, your insights are appreciated! At first the officer's actions seemed a bit excessive to me but taking the off screen factors that you've pointed out into account, I think he acted reasonably. So I'm glad that he was not found guilty. Surely he would have been offered an opportunity to receive some councling after this, I can only imagine that an event like that can eat at you from the inside.

[ikor]

Typically, Andy, officers in medium to large size agencies are required to see the department psychologist or psychiatrist before returning to full street-side duty. This is because even today there is a great deal of resistance to such counseling in the US Law Enforcement community as a whole. Thus many guys will refuse an 'offer' because they don't want to look like a pos or a wimp, etc...sad but that is how it is. Small agencies often do nothing at all beyond maybe a few days off with pay, since that is about all they can afford.

The stigma is much worse if the officer sees themselves as having 'lost' the engagement as you can imagine.

[JS4]

Oh, he won allright.

Might want to train some tac loads in future though.

[ikor]

Good point, but what we see is that in such situations, guys think they have fired maybe half as many rounds as they actually have. Given that, plus the fact that in the vast majority of single officer confrontations, the cops will have more ammo than they need, we usually teach a speed reload after assessing the situation. They can pick up the used mag later.

In this case maybe his backup arrived so fast he felt he did not need a reload, or maybe with the lady coming out and the associated drama he thought better of it, or maybe he just plain forgot...no way of knowing.

I think he done good all in all. Could we script a more perfect response? Of course we could, but we have the huge advantage of hindsight and the video...he did not.

And once again...pistols are pissant stoppers...NOT some sort of Death Ray!

[JS4]

Agreed.

Its more of a 'note to self' comment, for in our most likely scenarios there may not be backup that fast, and adrenaline coupled with shock can be paralysing (didn't even think about under-estimated round counts, thanks).

That lady's reaction was also an eye-opener - at some stage I thought that in her distressed state she might be heading for suicide by cop there, which had me worried for the officer and his amount of rounds remaining.

[DwayneA]

It looks like he got caught up and tripped on the seat belt while getting out the vehicle. The cop shot way to quickly and to many rounds in my opinion.

[BigT]

Good thing the investigators who actually had all the facts disagreed with you.

Would you rather the cop waited until he was stabbed to shoot , and then only paused as opposed to stop the threat?

[Todor]

It looks like he got caught up and tripped on the seat belt while getting out the vehicle. The cop shot way to quickly and to many rounds in my opinion.

Perfect example as to why opinions should never drive creation of new legislation.

[DwayneA]

The investigators had all the same "facts" we do, they used the same footage to determine the outcome. The video clearly shows them cutting the seat belt off his leg. Let get realistic he wasn't close enough to get stabbed and the guy had nothing in his hands, if he lunged forward with an object in his hands the cop already had his gun drawn and would have easily been able to fire a few shots then. I don't understand your use of "and then only paused"? I am entitled to my opinion am I not? Also what has this got to do with the creation of new legislation?

[Todor]

I am entitled to my opinion am I not? Also what has this got to do with the creation of new legislation?

Being facetious about general public opinion versus facts when it comes to using lethal force and then allowing that same public to cry "more gun control"...