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  1. #1

    Default A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    Gentleman & ladies,

    I have had the following request from John, which with his permission I am placing here because I have told him that if anybody can get it together, it is us, the Gunsite folks. If we can help we should....can we please see how best we can get the info together and collate for John? We need a champion to take over this thread and run hard with it and manage the team going forward. Any volunteers? In the event of a multiplicity of volunteers (my wishful thinking) we'll choose a chief champ and then sub-champs to team together....

    We urgently need recent stats to counter those that GFSA continually refer to.

    The following would be very helpful:
    The number of people unlawfully killed daily with firearms
    The number of firearms stolen annually from private possession
    The number of firearms annually stolen from SAPS & SANDF
    The number of firearms stolen from locked safes (among abovementioned groups)
    The number of instances lives were saved because of the production or use of a firearm
    Etc.

    Those with an interest in and knowledge of statistics and analysis are invited kindly to assist in compiling and analyzing.

  2. #2
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    I'll volunteer to help where I can with what I can.
    As to the data above, what time bracket (as in months and years) are we looking at going back to?
    How quickly do we need to get all this data together?

  3. #3
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    How does one decide if the stats is from a reliable source ?
    SAPS lost 1,335 firearms in 2010/2011 - Nathi Mthethwa : http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politic...tail&pid=71656
    3,226 police firearms lost or stolen in 2009/2010 - DA : http://www.politicsweb.co.za/politic...tail&pid=71656

  4. #4

    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    Quote Originally Posted by zulushark View Post
    I'll volunteer to help where I can with what I can.
    As to the data above, what time bracket (as in months and years) are we looking at going back to?
    How quickly do we need to get all this data together?
    Urgent. If you guys haven't realized it, we've got a potential major crisis on our hands. Gunsite is the only place we have that can crowd-source this kind of info fast. A lot of it is probably here already....

    Pull in your mates, roll up your sleeves and keep your rights!

  5. #5
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    We should start with the implementation date of the FCA. I will contact the SAHA for details and SAPS archives. I'll also start with the national archives and military archives for info.

    This is a major undertaking and needs a full time professional. I did post for donations to hire someone. I'm willing to put in R5000 to start and a monthly R500 going forward.

  6. #6

    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    I'm crap at stats but we should also keep to the bigger picture.

    GFSA wants to talk about crimes committed with guns ONLY. We have to keep the focus on VIOLENT CRIME AS A WHOLE.

    Sorry for the caps lock but I believe it is vital we redirect the argument to where it should be - violent crime Gun crime is a category of crime invented to give credence to gun control advocates. Using this, they include suicide figures as proof of the success of gun laws as fewer people use guns to top themselves, even if the suicide rate remains unchanged.

    We need figures for the at the least the years 1999 - 2004 as well. They are incredibly difficult to find. I always have my reservations but I have found I'm being forced to use Wikipedia!!

    Crime Stats SA goes back to 2004, but we need those earlier figures.

  7. #7
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    I'm so keen to help but I'm just so short of time at the moment. I'm more than willing to make a financuial contribution. What else could I help with? I can't promise anythin at the moment as I barely have time to do anything.

  8. #8
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    I will also contribute some funds if that is what is needed. My time is also short, but will make some time at night if someone wants to point me in the direction needed.

  9. #9

    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    Quote Originally Posted by Zoo Keeper View Post
    I'm crap at stats but we should also keep to the bigger picture.

    GFSA wants to talk about crimes committed with guns ONLY. We have to keep the focus on VIOLENT CRIME AS A WHOLE.

    Sorry for the caps lock but I believe it is vital we redirect the argument to where it should be - violent crime Gun crime is a category of crime invented to give credence to gun control advocates. Using this, they include suicide figures as proof of the success of gun laws as fewer people use guns to top themselves, even if the suicide rate remains unchanged.

    We need figures for the at the least the years 1999 - 2004 as well. They are incredibly difficult to find. I always have my reservations but I have found I'm being forced to use Wikipedia!!

    Crime Stats SA goes back to 2004, but we need those earlier figures.
    Good one.

  10. #10
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    Default Re: A second call for help – this time from John Welch

    WZ where are you based? Seems everybody is keen to chip in money.

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