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  1. #21
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    Quote Originally Posted by Messor View Post
    It's my understanding that there is no such classification, and that everybody who publishes such classifications just made it up.

    Old african saying, anything over 4.
    The english said medium up to 3, and big over 4.

    Then some folk have names like superbore and whatnot.

    SA's BASA based theirs on energy formulas, and everything from 9.3 and up.

    In my opinion, there ain't no such thing, because my 338 will out penetrate most of the big bores available these days.
    And many calibers over 40, like the 45-70 doesn't have the energy figures, meaning it's just a big caliber but not a big cartridge.
    The classification of calibers is frequently use , for example Pierre van der Walt in his African Dangerous Game Cartridges use a classification as follows:

    Transition Bore Cartridges 9.3x63/.378 Weatherby Magnum
    Large Bore Cartridges: 450/400 Nitro Express3" to 460 Weatherby Magnum
    Super Bore cartridges :500/465 Express H&H TO.600 Nitro Express

    Authors/Hunter John "Pondoro Taylor used it in his African Rifle and Cartridges book

    Terry Wieland as well use such a system..

    Many other writers/hunters ect use this system...

    I would suggest a 404 Jeffery will suite this gentleman perfectly..since it is a great classic caliber , brass/bullets are easily obtainable...

    I have one and it really is a great rifle to shoot and hunt with ....

  2. #22
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    Quote Originally Posted by Gert Odendaal View Post
    The classification of calibers is frequently use
    No I agree with that, I just said it's based on nothing.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    If you are in Cape Town go say hello at Brussel gunstockmakers, they have a beautiful jeffrey Ruger No.1 for sale.

  4. #24

    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    Anything above 375 the cost climbs, but it is still very possible to shoot it affordable.

    I practice with my 404 with 400gr Kriek Monolithic at R10 a pop or Claws at R13 a pop, I hunt with the Claws as well.

    If I go bushveld or DG hunting nothing else comes out of the safe than the 404.

    It is always nice to know that should you get into some sort of a hick-up that you have enough gun around!

    With Big Bores the brass is an expensive initial outlay, but as for bullets there are plenty options available and they all cost more or less the same over the range of calibers.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    A late friend of mine had a 458 and loaded it with 350 grain bullets for bush veld hunting. I was comfortable to shoot and there was no meat damage. He even shot a small warthog with it with not meat damage. All the animals I saw him shoot with this combination went staight down and stayed down. I thought it was a great close range bush veld rifle.

  6. #26
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    You could always get a CZ 458win and shoot it as is with a 450gr at 2150 that will equal the 450NE specs. And recoil is enjoyable.

    Brass is every where and affordable. Powder is S321. Magnum primer and bullets .... hornady, claw .....

  7. #27
    User 414gates's Avatar
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    Quote Originally Posted by mini-me View Post
    Hi guys has anyone got advise on a big bore. I am looking at getting a 458 lott. Is it over kilk ?
    With factory 500 grainers, probably yes except if you hunt DG.

    With handloading, no.

    Quote Originally Posted by mini-me View Post
    Should I rather look at an 375 or an 416 ?
    You can load a 458 Lott down to .375 or .416 ballistics, but you can't load those up to .458 Lott.

    It's a good big bore caliber choice, there are about a hundred different commercial bullets available. Safari is always in stock with brass.

    Don't pay too much attention to people that get technical about how impractical it is . Get what you like.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    Quote Originally Posted by huntley View Post
    A late friend of mine had a 458 and loaded it with 350 grain bullets for bush veld hunting. I was comfortable to shoot and there was no meat damage. He even shot a small warthog with it with not meat damage. All the animals I saw him shoot with this combination went staight down and stayed down. I thought it was a great close range bush veld rifle.
    I load a few Hornady .458 350 gr InterLock® RN to use in an upcoming hunt in Kathu ,the end of July to hunt warthog and kudu...I am making use of .458 cal Stewards Core bonded bullets as well and would like to see how these bullets perform as well....I really am looking forward to see how this loads will perform..If I get the chance to shoot a Duiker , I will take it since I need to see how much meat damage will occur....I think I loaded to a velocity of 2100 f/s...will make sure ... The .458 cal is an economical caliber for me to use since I use cast bullets to practice...the same goes for my 404 Jeffery..I sorted the difficulties regards to the re-loading of cast bullets loads and now it really performs excellently...

    Yes, big bore rifles do not need to be expensive when practicing...when hunting it is totally another subject altogether..then I only use premium bullets..I pay this with a smile,,,..since a wounded animal escaping is far more expensive than the premium bullets...

  9. #29
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    As an all-round rifle suitable to small and large game, including DG, the 375 (H&H or Ruger) is hard to beat. It is on the minimalist side for DG, but you would most likely take some backup along.

    Moving further up, the 404 Jeffrey has lots of merit, one of them being very manageable recoil. Gert got his to shoot cast bullets, so there is the solution for affordable practise and small game.

    Of the 458's my firm favourite is the 458 3" Express. It shoots at the same ballistics as the Lott, but with much less perceived recoil. The chambering was specifically developed for this reason, to eliminate the sharp recoil impulse of the shorter cased rounds. (There is a logical explanation for this.) Cases are available locally and are most affordable. It can also safely fire the Lott and Win Mag rounds in an emergency, although with slightly less accuracy. Suitable rifles are Brno ZKK602, CZ550 Magnum and Ruger No1 in 458 Win Mag, that you have reamed to the 3" chambering.

    There are indeed many other options, but they all seem more specialized to me. The 416 Rigby and it's larger 450 sibling have some allure, as do the big doubles. They also tend to stretch the wallet a bit further.

    I have once shot a Brno ZKK602 converted to 460 Weatherby, using Weatherby factory ammo (500gn at +/-2600fps). From that day on I'm just a little recoil sensitive, hence my reference to perceived recoil levels above.

  10. #30
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    Default Re: LookING for a big bore

    PM sent

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