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  1. #21
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Quote Originally Posted by Dale SH View Post
    Irresponsible reloaders will continue to blow shit up daily.
    You're absolutely correct.
    With heavy bullets, e.g. 300gr+ bullets in the .44Mag using powders like S265, there's not enough case capacity to get "irresponsible reloaders" into trouble, compared to S221. Read some of the posts in the handgun hunting section on this forum.

    Please keep in mind, QL does not always have all the answers, practical experience shared is invaluable.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Quote Originally Posted by swc-tr View Post
    You're absolutely correct.
    With heavy bullets, e.g. 300gr+ bullets in the .44Mag using powders like S265, there's not enough case capacity to get "irresponsible reloaders" into trouble, compared to S221. Read some of the posts in the handgun hunting section on this forum.
    You should be preaching this to people who load 9mm with S121.
    Do you really think I have not assisted numerous people on and off this forum with loading 44 Mag and have not been part of the practical part of the whole process ?
    Please don't be naive.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    So, If I understand correctly, if a re loader overcharges a case and has an incident, the powder is to blame.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Sorry Sean.
    Not quite getting you.
    What is your post referring to ?
    Of course you cant blame the powder.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Dale, I was referring to the S221 causing catastrophic failures in fire arms. I only have 1 handgun calibre to load(9mmp) for and use MP 200, MS 200 and S221.
    When I get a new tin, I drop my normal charge a bit, my loads are pretty sedate anyway but why take chances, and shoot a few usually over the chrony. This will give me an idea of whether to drop or increase the charge.
    The reason I approach a new tin of powder with a little caution is that I read an article which claimed that powder batches may vary as much as 15% from published values.

    So surely a person loading for a magnum calibre, possibly close to max pressure would exercise some caution when beginning to use a new batch of powder.

    Or are the problems encountered halfway through the tin using same weight of bullet and powder - referring to S221

  6. #26
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Aaah OK I get you now.

    Your theory is 100% correct and one is fooling themselves if you blindly believe that you can use the same load as before when changing tins of powder.
    You are also quite right in saying that even Somchem have established that some of their batches of propellant can deviate by as much as 15%.
    What messes with my mind and specifically in terms of S221 is that Lot 213 was for all intents and purposes - dangerous and should have been recalled but wasn't.
    Some of the subsequent batches according to Somchem show an even higher deviation than Lot 213 - so now what ? These subsequent batches should have been even more violent than Lot 213 but we didn't hear anything about them blowing up handguns. Lot 215 then by deduction should have been dynamite in comparison.
    In my opinion it is just downright irresponsible of Somchem to not pull these batches or give the reloading fraternity a clear and concise warning that the stuff is packed with chilies instead of propellant. As far we are concerned they could have just as easily put S121 in the wrong cans.
    No not Somchem - just kyk noord and vok voort.

    If the stuff does exhibit the thermochemical properties it is supposed to it remains a valid choice in terms of it's suitability when loading certain calibers with specific bullet weights.

    http://www.somchemreload.com/propellants/s221

  7. #27
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    Thanks for that Dale. That clears that up. I do see now how even a cautious re loader could run into trouble or be reluctant to continue using it.
    Security in science.

  8. #28
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    Default Re: 44cal Bullet Choice - assistance needed

    I have used S221 in 4 calibres so far: 9mm, 10mm, 357 and 44. The only KB was with a start load of S221 lot 213 in my 10mm. Ruptured the case and blew out the mag. Pistol is fortunately unscathed. Had this been in a revolver, that can not really rupture a case over the feed ramp, results might have been somewhat less bearable.

    I would guess lot 213 to be about 25% faster than spec, which places it right next to MP200. Using MP200 load data should be safe (weight, not volume!).

    My experience with the 44Mag is with the 300gn XTP and 240gn Nosler bullet. In revolvers with long cylinders, the 300gn bullet can be seated longer to create space for a healthy charge of S265. The magazine length of the Ruger rifle likely does not allow that. The 240gn bullet should work well with both S265 and S221. You are not very likely to overload it with S265. S221 is much denser, so tread carefully there.

    I would expect the 240gn XTP bullet to give very decent terminal performance on medium sized game, if used sensibly.

    Should you ever consider a subsonic load, bullets in the 300 - 320 gn region should give decent results.

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