Use of Deadly Force in Self-Defense

**PeaceOfficer** · 21-11-2020, 11:58

It's a long video (and admittedly slow compared to the glamour IG vids) but the man spews volumes of knowledge.

It's worth listening to a couple times over to understand the factors taken into account when deadly force is used. Obviously, it's predicated on the US system but still a lot that we can take from it; specifically the disparity of force issue which was alluded to in recent local events.

**WessonCountry** · 21-11-2020, 12:08

What you reckon of this video? Self defense or attempted murder? Not sure his life was under threat as the fellows seemed like they may have been on the way out, but who knows what/if they were packing

https://twitter.com/i/status/1329732737046110208

**curious george** · 21-11-2020, 12:17

Originally Posted by WessonCountry

What you reckon of this video? Self defense or attempted murder? Not sure his life was under threat as the fellows seemed like they may have been on the way out, but who knows what/if they were packing

https://twitter.com/i/status/1329732737046110208

I don't get why you are even asking this question?

**McD2304** · 21-11-2020, 13:22

I reckon get that man a bells!

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**PeaceOfficer** · 21-11-2020, 13:55

Way to derail a thread.

**WessonCountry** · 21-11-2020, 13:59

It's an interesting example of the points raised in the OP's video.

For the shooter: he was outnumbered and probably in a position where the attackers could use their physical advantage against him.

For the attackers: he seems to have shot them when they were leaving (assuming they were leaving), when maybe his life was no longer in danger and we don't see any guns in the attackers hands (i.e. disproportionate use of force).

Not making a moral argument, but would be interested to see how a court views this video - in the absence of sound (maybe they said they were going to kill him?) Good chance he could catch an attempted murder charge.

**SASwart** · 21-11-2020, 14:27

Originally Posted by PeaceOfficer

It's a long video (and admittedly slow compared to the glamour IG vids) but the man spews volumes of knowledge.

It's worth listening to a couple times over to understand the factors taken into account when deadly force is used. Obviously, it's predicated on the US system but still a lot that we can take from it; specifically the disparity of force issue which was alluded to in recent local events.

v=pA5_pdmBI2E&t=1s&ab_channel=WilsonCombat[/video]

Thanks for the share

**curious george** · 21-11-2020, 16:36

Originally Posted by WessonCountry

It's an interesting example of the points raised in the OP's video.

For the shooter: he was outnumbered and probably in a position where the attackers could use their physical advantage against him.

For the attackers: he seems to have shot them when they were leaving (assuming they were leaving), when maybe his life was no longer in danger and we don't see any guns in the attackers hands (i.e. disproportionate use of force).

Not making a moral argument, but would be interested to see how a court views this video - in the absence of sound (maybe they said they were going to kill him?)

You are making many assumptions based on a single camera angle with no sound,and if you have ever been in a robbery and used your firearm in self defence or intervened as a 3rd party, you would know that you don't need to overthink this.The courts aren't interested if it's a clean shoot like this example.

Originally Posted by WessonCountry

Good chance he could catch an attempted murder charge.

Who told you that nonsense? Urban myths abound, backed up by gfsa propaganda and perpetuated out of ignorance. Not saying it hasn't happened where there were instances of malicious prosecution, but from personal experience it's not the rule.

**WessonCountry** · 21-11-2020, 16:48

Originally Posted by curious george

You are making many assumptions based on a single camera angle with no sound,and if you have ever been in a robbery and used your firearm in self defence or intervened as a 3rd party, you would know that you don't need to overthink this.The courts aren't interested if it's a clean shoot like this example.

Who told you that nonsense? Urban myths abound, backed up by gfsa propaganda and perpetuated out of ignorance. Not saying it hasn't happened where there were instances of malicious prosecution, but from personal experience it's not the rule.

There's no need for the emotive language and accusations of 'ignorance'. I qualified my statements and mentioned the lack of sound - and suggested several times the single video angle was not perfect.

it was simply an example of a grey area that speaks to the points raised in the video you shared.

It's not 'propaganda' to mention that South Africa's guns laws have clearly defined parameters for when lethal force is legal and when it is not regardless of your personal experience.

Keep it respectful, please.

**Grobbie** · 21-11-2020, 17:46

Originally Posted by WessonCountry

There's no need for the emotive language and accusations of 'ignorance'. I qualified my statements and mentioned the lack of sound - and suggested several times the single video angle was not perfect.

it was simply an example of a grey area that speaks to the points raised in the video you shared.

It's not 'propaganda' to mention that South Africa's guns laws have clearly defined parameters for when lethal force is legal and when it is not regardless of your personal experience.

Keep it respectful, please.

How did you get to the conclusion that their could be an attempted murder charge?

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