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Thread: UKRAINE updates

  1. #21
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Does anyone have reliable information on the real strength and capabilities of the Russian military machine, I'd be curious to know if they have the capability to do a full scale invasion or maybe just able to nibble a bit more at the currently occupied territories.

    The Nato head honcho said just look at the satellite images if there is any doubt, everyone can see. Not verbatim but close enough.
    I don't have any links to any satellites so wouldn't know where to start.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by Sean KZN View Post
    Does anyone have reliable information on the real strength and capabilities of the Russian military machine, I'd be curious to know if they have the capability to do a full scale invasion or maybe just able to nibble a bit more at the currently occupied territories.

    The Nato head honcho said just look at the satellite images if there is any doubt, everyone can see. Not verbatim but close enough.
    I don't have any links to any satellites so wouldn't know where to start.
    They have nukes. And they know how to use them. And they can hit any target they want.
    So they are effectively free to bully.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by zguy View Post
    They have nukes. And they know how to use them. And they can hit any target they want.
    So they are effectively free to bully.
    Using nuclear bombs / misiles etc on any piece of the globe you might need as a resource (or want to visit and not start glowing in the dark) at some future date is the same as shitting on pizza so the other guy will leave it for you to eat all by yourself.

    Sure I can understand nuking some place far away if you really dont like the people there and NEVER want to go there or dont want other people to go there EVER. But poisoning a pretty large area and making it a no go zone for a fuck-load of time for yourself or anyone else makes no sense to me.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by M43 View Post
    Using nuclear bombs / misiles etc on any piece of the globe you might need as a resource (or want to visit and not start glowing in the dark) at some future date is the same as shitting on pizza so the other guy will leave it for you to eat all by yourself.

    Sure I can understand nuking some place far away if you really dont like the people there and NEVER want to go there or dont want other people to go there EVER. But poisoning a pretty large area and making it a no go zone for a fuck-load of time for yourself or anyone else makes no sense to me.
    They won't nuke any country in Europe. They will just threaten Uncle Sam with it. And if Uncle Sam wont intervene, no one else will.
    Basically, cold war style threats. That's why the US doesn't pick fights with China, Russia, and NK. Because , you are right, its not a smart move to nuke randomly.
    But can you trust one of those countries to not pull a dumb move, just out of spite?

    That's why the US bombs countries they don't like that start 'nuclear research'. To prevent them getting one up.

    I am not sure how capable Russia's military is compared to the US, but the nuclear weapons is a massive deterrent.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    So if WW3 kicks off, will Russia and China get Durbans port functional again?

    Surely being a BRICS member we are on the "other side" here

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by Springer View Post
    I doubt that would have resulted in what we are seeing. If anything, he was played like a recorder at a brownie weekend by Vladimir.
    That's a picture I can't let go of, thanks!

    What I was really getting at is the the Biden clan was balls deep in Ukraine and that whatever papa Bidden has done and does or doesn't do, needs to be looked at with that in mind.

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Ukraine: roots and consequences of the crisis

    Quote Originally Posted by M43 View Post
    Using nuclear bombs / misiles etc on any piece of the globe you might need as a resource (or want to visit and not start glowing in the dark) at some future date is the same as shitting on pizza so the other guy will leave it for you to eat all by yourself.

    Sure I can understand nuking some place far away if you really dont like the people there and NEVER want to go there or dont want other people to go there EVER. But poisoning a pretty large area and making it a no go zone for a fuck-load of time for yourself or anyone else makes no sense to me.
    You also cant walk back from a nuclear strike. It is quite literally, "The nuclear option" and I can't believe that anyone this side of the Kim Jong-un line of barking madness would be able to imagine a strategic aim that it would achieve.
    Last edited by oafpatroll; 21-02-2022 at 10:30. Reason: Correction for clarity

  8. #28

    Default Re: Ukraine

    Some interesting and plausible theories have been offered in this thread. According to the US the military build up continues and this morning it was reported that Russia has 75% of its army on the Ukraine border. As others have suggested, perhaps the intention is not to invade, and one TV commentator (I forget which, there are so many) that the intention is to subject Ukraine to continuous threat, psychological warfare I suppose, until it gives Russia what it wants. It is reported that it has already adversely affected Ukraine's GDP and will undoubtedly reduce foreign investment if it continues.

    But I am still of the view that a credible porcupine style defense posture would be a good idea. Of course, Ukraine doesn't enjoy Switzerland's mountain defense barrier, but a credible defense is a lot better than none or too little. It was reported somewhere that the Ukraine government has called upon it's citizens to be prepared to defend, but I think we can all see the obvious difficulty of untrained and unfit people defending against the Russian army. On the other hand a civilian militia that enjoys massive numerical superiority could be a tough nut to crack. But to make that credible would take a lot of weapons and training to be supplied from outside. At the bottom end it would need a lot of small arms including a big percentage of sniping rifles also including 50cal and enough training to provide a lot of people with enough competence to use them if only to a modest standard. Would also need a lot of stingers and anti-tank missiles and the training to use them. But hey, these are just thoughts - I don't expect anything of the sort to be done. But if it isn't, calling on civilians to defend is a bit silly. It just strikes me as ridiculous not to prepare a credible defense when it can be done as far as I can judge.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Ukraine

    Quote Originally Posted by FrancoisOK View Post
    No doubt they have the means to do that, but the babbling old man in the White House and his woke cohorts does not have the stomach to count body bags. And this war will make Afghanistan look like a picnic !
    They have also proven themselves to be incompetent with respect to the mismanagement of military forces. No-one but Jen Psaki with a head full of mescaline could believe that the self made Afghan disaster hasn't emboldened every one of the US' adversaries.

  10. #30

    Default Re: Ukraine

    Well the West during the collapse of the Berlin wall promised Russia not to move Western bases or interests closer to Russia.

    But the West just went on and did it.

    When Russia moved rockets to Cuba the USA nearly freaked out and the Cuban missile crisis started.

    Now if Ukraine joins Nato. The West especially USA will open military basis in Ukraine as they do with all European countries.

    This means the USA will have a military foothold on Russian Doorsteps. Same as Cuban crisis just other way around now. This after a promise was made when the wall came down.

    So in fact Putin/Russia is actually right to put down their foot to say No way is the west especially USA putting basis up in Ukraine on our border.

    Actually Russia has done nothing wrong so far. Its merely put soldiers by its own border protecting it. It has not crossed it yet. And Russia has said not planning to. Maybe they lying.

    But then USA is the country claiming attack imminent. The same USA who swore there was weapons of mass destruction in Iraq and got all the allies to attack. And then it was found there was nothing. And all acted on false information.

    USA makes millions and billions out of wars. So far to me it looks more like USA trying to cry wolf again and start a war.

    USA who cant protect its own Southern Border who is now upset about a Russian Ukraine Border on another continent.

    If Russia were to take Ukraine. There is rumours that China will follow and take Taiwan back.

    At moment Russia and China is the world leaders. Under Biden USA is like a 3rd world country. Scaring no one.

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