Pistol AR's

[Skaaphaas]

On a side note - I would personally prefer a platform with a non-reciprocating charging lever where I may be required to use it in tight confines like in a vehicle and where it may be required to shoot with close retention to the body.

Very interesting point, and very valid.

[Andy37]

I have an evil fetish for SBRs and own a few. Wrt 5.56, the following has been my experiences; blast and muzzle flash are massive issues with SBRs, especially my Sig 553 (8.9")- this is mitigated by loading decent heavier bullets at proper loads- there is almost zero flash, but blast remains a problem. Heavier bullets also help mitigate the inevitable degradation in MV- bear in mind5.56 needs juice to work down range..the same loads make factor out a LM6 comfortably- their terminal ballistics at the lower velocities may need to be looked at carefully though. My experiments with SBR 7.62 have so far not reduced the flash yet, the bigger bore and heavier bullet however have a degree of comfort built into them that 5.56 lacks.
As much as I like my shortie 5.56s, I can still get a better outcome at 10 meters from a 52gr THV out a short barreled .357 SIG P229, without the radical blast and muzzle flash issues. The 229 conceals better, and most social encounters are within it's range. Taking nothing away from the attraction of SBRs, but their uses, especially in a caliber that needs to be driven hard are limited by their lack of velocity. As for accuracy, I'll leave that to people who shoot past 200m with them to comment, but intuitively, the slower vels must retard trajectory at longer ranges.
In reality, where your most likely application is at ranges less than 50 meters for SD, they are adequate. Multiple hits, center mass applies.

[47]

On a side note - I would personally prefer a platform with a non-reciprocating charging lever where I may be required to use it in tight confines like in a vehicle and where it may be required to shoot with close retention to the body.

Very good point Khumba - what specific rifles would you have in mind when taking this into consideration?

[47]

I have an evil fetish for SBRs and own a few. Wrt 5.56, the following has been my experiences; blast and muzzle flash are massive issues with SBRs, especially my Sig 553 (8.9")- this is mitigated by loading decent heavier bullets at proper loads- there is almost zero flash, but blast remains a problem. Heavier bullets also help mitigate the inevitable degradation in MV- bear in mind5.56 needs juice to work down range..the same loads make factor out a LM6 comfortably- their terminal ballistics at the lower velocities may need to be looked at carefully though. My experiments with SBR 7.62 have so far not reduced the flash yet, the bigger bore and heavier bullet however have a degree of comfort built into them that 5.56 lacks.
As much as I like my shortie 5.56s, I can still get a better outcome at 10 meters from a 52gr THV out a short barreled .357 SIG P229, without the radical blast and muzzle flash issues. The 229 conceals better, and most social encounters are within it's range. Taking nothing away from the attraction of SBRs, but their uses, especially in a caliber that needs to be driven hard are limited by their lack of velocity. As for accuracy, I'll leave that to people who shoot past 200m with them to comment, but intuitively, the slower vels must retard trajectory at longer ranges.
In reality, where your most likely application is at ranges less than 50 meters for SD, they are adequate. Multiple hits, center mass applies.

Very interesting Andy. Something that I have been wondering about. Thanks for sharing!

[DS]

Very good point Khumba - what specific rifles would you have in mind when taking this into consideration?

Well I will be unpopular but it is what it is - the AK platform has a reciprocating charging lever and shares that trait with the SCAR, the VZ, the Sig556 ( I have a 556r and I love it btw) the CZ 805 Bren and I am sure more can be added.

Those that do not have a reciprocating cl are FAL, AR, ACR, AUG.

So the PDW AR with a compact suppressor makes a lot of sense for real confined use like using it from inside a vehicle for instance or covered by a cover garment like a jacket. The NEA 7.5" with a compact suppressor and the PDW stock will be really hard to beat in this role imo as will the AUG.

The FS2000 with it's trickle forward eject will be awesome for inside vehicle use.

[47]

Thanks Khumba!