Training pointing dogs

[tracker]

Hi All
The pleasure of hunting with well trained pointers is unsurpassed.
Training a pointer is a journey were you take a young pup and spend many hours in the veld together. You both learn from each other, no two dogs are the same.After a while you both know whats required and become a team.
This process must take time,patience and understanding.Novice trainers can and do make basic errors resulting in the dog developing bad habits ,which if not correct early can lead to problems throughout the dogs life.
We have all been on hunts were an untrained dog has spoilt the day for all.
A novice handler should enlist the help of more experiance handlers to assist in the development of the dog.
Many clubs exist,where members are more than happy to assist in the training.
www.saftc.co.za has many tips and contacts to assist with the training of dogs.
This club has regular get togethers during the winter months to train pointing dogs.
Novice trainer can benefit from the years of experiance many of the old hands can pass on during the sessions.Training pointer is fun

[CraigMac]

Hi Tracker

I have to agree with you. I have trained up my first dog, a male GSP. He is a year old now and it is an incredible experience to see him work, or run up to you with a bird that he has pointed and retrieved. The transvaal HPR club is also a great help in training tips and the old hands are very willing to help new owners. Having a pointer adds huge amounts to your hunting experience.

Cheers

[Just Plain Phil]

Does the www.saftc.co.za (The Dirty Dozen) still exits. I heard ( perhaps incorrectly) that the Club had closed it's doors ?

[tracker]

Does the www.saftc.co.za (The Dirty Dozen) still exits. I heard ( perhaps incorrectly) that the Club had closed it's doors ?

The SAFTC is very much alive and well.It celebrated it's centenary in 2008.Published a 150 page book on it's history and the history of trailing from 1908 when the club was formed.
The sport of field trailing is losing members as a result of:-
1.Costs, we have to travel further and further to find suitable cover and quantities of birds to train our dogs. Round trips of over 150 Km are not uncommon.
2.The bunny huggers are preventing young people from wanting to hunt over dogs.
3.Politics, within the sport (feuding within clubs) and the country(firearm laws) etc.
A few breakway member started a new club and tried without success to hijack the clubs name.This is most lightly were the perception that the SAFTC has closed or is closing has originated from.
4.Safety. Handler have been attacked when returning to a car at the end of a training session. Saftey of the family while we are out training is also a concern.
5.Loss of focus by the clubs, recently the judging of trails has moved to far from the use of a pointer in the actual hunting situation.Rather than be a mean too an end i.e "the breeding of great hunting dogs", the trails have become an end in themselves, to the determent of the breeds and hunting.
The above are all reasons why clubs are experincing reducing memberships

More recently the SAFTC obtained exclusive use of 3000 hectares in the Settlers area to train dogs,hold trails and training workshops.A house has been put at the disposal of club members who wish to spend the week end training.This facility is being developed to draw in new members who wish to train their dogs.The SAFTC will use this facility to encourage,develop and protect the future of the pointing breeds by good fellowship, responsible breeding and the protection of our game birds and enviroment for the use of dog handler/hunters for generations to come
Basically it intends to make training fun by creating an enviroment for like minded hunters/handlers to get together around a camp fire and discuss dogs,birds,guns and hunting tales.
Life is to short to hunt over bad dogs
Cheers

[tracker]

Hi CraigMac
You are correct on both counts,you get what you put in,the more you train your dog the better it becomes. A year of hard work results in a hunting partnership which delivers many year of pleasure,fun and great memories.Take lots of pictures because as we get older we tend to forget how good our dogs realy are.
Secondly,Slang and his club do great work at promoting hunting over GSP's,expecially with novice handlers.
Regards
Tracker.

[CraigMac]

Hi Tracker

Thanks. An interesting point on trials. I did a puppy trial simply because it was a pre-requisite for listing my dog with HPR's breeding list. I would have done the natural ability anyway for my own sake. My opinion of trials ( remember that this is coming from a novice one-dog owner, so hardly an informed opinion) is that they are made up of a large number of people who do not actually hunt with their dogs and who are more interested in conforming to the breed standard as opposed to a talented dog who performs well in the field.
I like some clubs approach which appears to be more on dog field performance than breed standard and with a focus on maintaining high levels of hunting ability.
Again I may be incorrect but I have heard that a number of hunting breeds like the weimaraner have slowly lost the field skills as they are bred for judging and not working.
Just a personal opinion...
Cheers

[ikor]

Hi Tracker

Thanks. An interesting point on trials. I did a puppy trial simply because it was a pre-requisite for listing my dog with HPR's breeding list. I would have done the natural ability anyway for my own sake. My opinion of trials ( remember that this is coming from a novice one-dog owner, so hardly an informed opinion) is that they are made up of a large number of people who do not actually hunt with their dogs and who are more interested in conforming to the breed standard as opposed to a talented dog who performs well in the field.
I like some clubs approach which appears to be more on dog field performance than breed standard and with a focus on maintaining high levels of hunting ability.
Again I may be incorrect but I have heard that a number of hunting breeds like the weimaraner have slowly lost the field skills as they are bred for judging and not working.
Just a personal opinion...
Cheers

This is the age old schizm between 'show' dog people and 'working' dog people.The show people invariably worm their way into various breed clubs, etc. and then start promoting THEIR idea of 'the standard'...which generally amounts to a beauty contest...especially so when the judge has no idea what performance standards are actually necessary in the breed if it is to fulfill its intended purpose.

You will see it in every working breed that becomes popular, and the end result is always that the two groups split and it becomes more and more impossible for a 'champion' in one group to even be competitive in the other. SA has managed to escape some of this foolishness over the years but not all, and as fewer and fewer people hunt, I predict you will see it happen with the sporting breeds that have managed thus far to escape most of it. Those who have Weimaraners, Vislas, setters and some spaniels that will hunt and hunt well should cherish them and consider breeding...if for no other reason than to keep the working dogs in the breed alive.

[CraigMac]

Agree with you on that Ikor.

Happy hunting this bird season, guineas open now....francolin in a few days...looking forward to that!

[tracker]

Agree with both CraigMac and Ikor. The soul purpuse of a pointers body is to propel it's nose through the air and find scent.It is important that physical and psychological features are present. My experience is mainly with the English pointer breed. If you hunt greywing in the Eastern Cape the dog must have a deep chest, massive lung capacity, hunt head up and be of a size and strength to range far and wide and use the wind to best effect. The working pointer must be able to work with strange dogs and hunt as a brace for the hunters. An average working pointer is built like an athlete, be agile and have a desire the find birds. Unfortunately in the show arena none of the above characteristics are important or required. I’m not in any way knocking the show dog enthusiast, provided show dogs are not passed of as working dogs.

A problem with breeding pointers in the field trail fraternity is that selection is made almost exclusively on the dog’s performance in the trails. Win or place well and your dog will be used for breeding. No regards is given to the breed standard, with the result we are breeding dogs which are gradually becoming smaller and smaller. Some lines have become short and stocky; the offspring look more like pit bulls that pointers .The smooth almost effortless movement of a pointer as it hunts is being replaced by dogs which run with short choppy strides. The natural beauties of working pointers features are gradually being lost.
This concerns me greatly. A few trailers are starting to suggest that we judge the dogs on their hunting ability and after the field work a bench section should be included for the top dogs. Hopefully this would result in good hunting dogs which conform to the standard, being used for breeding.This is how it's done in Europe.
LIFE IS TOO SHORT TO HUNT WITH UGLY USELESS DOGS.

[ikor]

I think that would be a very good idea, Tracker, provided the judges were Pointer hunters as well and understood what is needed in the breed. Here in the states, English Pointers that work on plantations also need to range wide and cover ground as hunters use horses or at the least wagons for the 'sports' who can't ride. More 'normal' guys (who usually hunt small acreages on foot) tend to want a pointer that is more like a GSP but in some cases have ended up breeding English Pointers who hunt close and are smaller as you note is happening in SA.

The plantations never show their dogs and cull with a heavy hand...not at all what the show dog lovers would like to hear, so they keep it to themselves...but they breed some of the best in the world.