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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    T - dunno what your experience with the .22 and living targets is, but if you not an old hand with the .22 you going to be sorely disappointed with what it can do. CNS hits aside the R/N bullet is as effective as throwing marshmallows at target animal.
    The use of the .22 for hunting is to me one of those things that does not get spoken about honestly (a bit like what happens to the 40 geese that get shot by wing shooters - 'Sssshhh!, It's a subject best left undisturbed"
    I have killed up to Common Reebuck with the .22 (30 years ago), some fell right there and some......................

    The hollow point ammo is in my opinion like 10 x more effective than the round point and it is still a very VERY poor killer CNC shots aside. I have shot so many monkey absolutely perfectly in the vitals only to watch them with binno's go sit somewhere and take an hour to die. (Problem animals in close proximity to dairy cattle, dairy stations and offices. One shot one direction situations)

    I have also shot Gypo's and Guinea fowl using H/P ammo and gotten really mixed results for same ammo on different birds. In short, the .22 really just does not kill reliably.

    The use of Hyper Velocity ammunition changes this scenario dramatically. Do yourself a favour, get a big orange or 5 and shoot them with R/N and H/P ammo, then shoot with the Hyper ammo (you can reuse the R/N bullet oranges, they will have no visual harm too them, in fact you may battle to find the shot holes)

    Summery
    The R/N orange may not even fall off the pole it’s put on, you may battle to find entrance hole and not much more than a mark at exit.

    The H/P orange will have a small entrance hole and perhaps a tear or possibly a finger nail size damaged spot at exit.

    The Hyper velocity orange will be pretty much gone from the entrance hole on wards. The hyper velocity through an orange makes some nice video footage in slow motion.

    I still shoot "for eating" animals with the .22, but with much for warning on expectations. Birds are shot shoulder to shoulder and rabbits are shot behind head high neck into head shots.
    I no longer shoot monkeys with the .22 (other than the extreme no alternative dairy and under cover problem animals scenario)

    as for barrel length, I do not believe there is much gain after 16" and that 18" is ample. After 18" some rifles were noted to have lower velocities than their shorter brethren.
    I will bet you a box of Swartklip against a box of match's that the 25" barrel you have there is slower than it would be at 20 " or 16" for that matter.
    PS: I have the 512 Sport master + about 7 others, the range is very good, very accurate - bargain buy best kept secret kinda rifles.

    Just my mumbling, bumbling experience.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    In regard to silencer - buy the slip on type, works as well as threaded in low recoil applications.
    The silencer makes for a different somewhat subdued sound compared to un-silenced when using non sub sonic. The bang is gone but the crack is still there ????
    You will then also be able to when needed use subsonic/silencer application, nice around horses and dairy cattle applications.

  3. #23
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    Thanks Treeman. My experience with the 22lr is very limited, compared to center fire rifles. Years ago, I got good results on monkeys with Remington Yellow Jacket ammo, at close range. Not sure if that was hyper velocity and if it is still available. It used a bullet with a huge hollow point. I am not going to be shooting hundreds of any of the animals I mentioned above, just the occasional trouble makers at close range and in situations where a center fire is not a good idea. I was looking for a .22 WMR but then happened across this rifle in good condition and at a price I couldn't really refuse.

  4. #24
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    My CBC .22 had a bulged barrel, which we chopped down by roughly 5 inches to almost 15 inches. Accuracy was worse after the operation; I used to get thumb nail sized groups at 25m before chopping, and it opened up to one inch afterwards, and sometimes even more. The chrony explained it: the shorter barrel delivered higher bullet speeds, but instead of staying below 1125fps (speed of sound) roughly half the shots went up to slightly over 1200fps. The bullets breaking the sound barrier resulted in a loss of accuracy, and an excuse to buy different types of ammo. Currently I use 36gr CCI HV's, and accuracy is almost back to acceptable. HV's generally work better in this little rifle.I also noticed that all my firearms tend deliver much better accuracy if I really concentrate when shooting My .22 is silenced and works wonderful with subsonic bullets. Only the trajectory puts me down from permanently switching over to them.Regarding the handling ability of the chopped rifle, I really enjoy it shorter. My silencer is slightly skew, and I do contemplate shortening the barrel to 12 inches.Firing HV's through the silencer is softer than usual, but not soft. Firing subs through the silencer is really soft. At night the sound lmight travel a bit, I have not tried it yet. The silencer does not affect accuracy. My guess would be that almost all regular .22LR ammunition would be supersonic with a 12 inch barrel.

  5. #25
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    There are so many factors involved in barrel length. If you look on the internet you will see people saying 18, 16 ,14 ,22. The first "study" in recent times said 18 and that ran like wildfire because it was at a time when everyone wanted to know HOW LONG. People missed the previous oke who got his best at 20 and the other who got 14 (they also cut the barrel shorter by 1 or 2 inches at a time).

    If I had to choose I would also stay in the 16 to 22 range but I would look with a bore brush where a choke point is and cut two or three finger after that hoping that I get good accuracy.

    On the Shootingstuff website they say Warrior has reflex silencers for .22s. I do not know how well they work or if the overall length is shorter.

    https://www.shootingstuff.co.za/fire...cer-22-lr.html

    Numenor also does reflex silencers and AFAIK they cost R2500 fitted. They prefer dong it in house and for good reason.

  6. #26
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    A big rumor on the net says that crossing the sound barrier throws ammo off course.
    Here's an interesting look at slow vs fast / HV vs SV at distance, going through the transsonic zone, wrt tumbling / destabilizing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK_neEXC1Pw

  7. #27
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    Quote Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
    There are so many factors involved in barrel length. If you look on the internet you will see people saying 18, 16 ,14 ,22. The first "study" in recent times said 18 and that ran like wildfire because it was at a time when everyone wanted to know HOW LONG. People missed the previous oke who got his best at 20 and the other who got 14 (they also cut the barrel shorter by 1 or 2 inches at a time).

    If I had to choose I would also stay in the 16 to 22 range but I would look with a bore brush where a choke point is and cut two or three finger after that hoping that I get good accuracy.

    On the Shootingstuff website they say Warrior has reflex silencers for .22s. I do not know how well they work or if the overall length is shorter.

    https://www.shootingstuff.co.za/fire...cer-22-lr.html

    Numenor also does reflex silencers and AFAIK they cost R2500 fitted. They prefer dong it in house and for good reason.
    ****************************
    slip on at R900 does the job every bit as good as R2500

  8. #28
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    Quote Originally Posted by Meteor View Post
    A big rumor on the net says that crossing the sound barrier throws ammo off course.
    Here's an interesting look at slow vs fast / HV vs SV at distance, going through the transsonic zone, wrt tumbling / destabilizing.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SK_neEXC1Pw
    Not at all what I intend to do with this rifle but still interesting viewing.

    For my intended purpose, I would rather choose a bullet that groups in 1" at 50m but expand well, providing better terminal performance than one that groups in ˝" at 50m but fails to expand and pencils through the target animal. If it comes to that, I am willing to reduce the maximum range, rather than reduce terminal performance.

  9. #29
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    They abit expensive but cci stingers grouped well out to 50m from my jw15 sub 1inch. I think the cci stingers are meant for varmiting. The case is a little longer than normal 22lr cases so velocity is higher as well
    No idea barrel length on the jw15

  10. #30
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    Default Re: Optimum .22lr barrel length?

    Quote Originally Posted by TStone View Post
    Not at all what I intend to do with this rifle but still interesting viewing.

    For my intended purpose, I would rather choose a bullet that groups in 1" at 50m but expand well, providing better terminal performance than one that groups in ˝" at 50m but fails to expand and pencils through the target animal. If it comes to that, I am willing to reduce the maximum range, rather than reduce terminal performance.
    ****
    The hypers will give you a 1" group with reasonable certainty at 50 out to about 70 m they gave me cigarette box 20ties groups, will look at my targets and whats up you some groups.

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