Cele on guns: Amended Firearms Control Act cannot allow individuals to own more than one gun

[Messor]

Communists cares only about control, with control over people comes power and money.
What do they do, same as in this debate, they create laws and rules that suits their purposes.
And who interprets the law, not the people they employ?

Ok let me rather ask this, which communist country was corrected by its own law system?

[MariusT]

The last three paragraphs in this News24 article states that Judge Froneman in the constitutional court judgement ruled that "gun owners with expires licenses would have to surrender their firams to the police". Is this poor reporting or what did I miss?

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[Brenneke]

Communists cares only about control, with control over people comes power and money.
What do they do, same as in this debate, they create laws and rules that suits their purposes.
And who interprets the law, not the people they employ?

Ok let me rather ask this, which communist country was corrected by its own law system?

You and I can see things that others cannot -- or -- will not !

I am not saying stop the legal processes
What I am saying is that even if ALL gun-owners were in solidarity it would still make NO difference to the current ANC / SACP government
THEY have an agenda -- the legal concerns of innocent firearms owners is NOT part of that agenda !
EVERYONE needs to -- fess up pretty quickly to this reality

The fact that the "wonderful" constitution was interpreted by Constitutional Court Judge Froneman as stating that firearm ownership is NOT a right ....
Means that the ANC / SACP now have the LEGAL powers to confiscate ALL firearms ... ( Parliament and the courts are NOT going to be able to stop this ! )
Just as they soon will have the LEGAL power to confiscate YOUR property

I am NOT being frivolous when I say that this is -- WAR !
ALL the signs are there -- just look North of the border -- ask anyone of the people that lived in Eastern Europe -- ask anyone that has had to deal with / fight communists -- ask the RHODESIAN'S !

I suggest you start preparing .........

[Messor]

There were many people across the world who trusted in laws and governments who saw their asses very hard, I believe we will be no different, we sit with the added burden that other countries simply will not help us.

A few wise founding fathers in a country somewhere west knew this, they made it law that citizens could protect themselves against all evil. Funny enough it just so happens that their lawmakers are trying their best to rob their citizens of their firearms as well. The process of control comes with obedience, it’s much easier to make people obey you when you’ve got all the weapons.

I’ve said it many times before, when the day comes and the law is passed, those now saying they will not give up their weapons, when the police is at their doors what will they do? Desperation is not something most gun owners understand very well.

[Zoo Keeper]

The last three paragraphs in this News24 article states that Judge Froneman in the constitutional court judgement ruled that "gun owners with expires licenses would have to surrender their firams to the police". Is this poor reporting or what did I miss?

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This is correct.

However, thanks to GOSA, it has been found (in court) that the police are too incompetent and corrupt to be trusted have no ability to handle the firearms, and are so corrupt that they cannot be trusted with taking in, and managing about 440 000 firearms and approximately 60 000 000 rounds of ammo (the number would have grown by now). The court took judicial notice of the endemic incompetence and corruption in the police. The police illegally changed their system to prevent renewals being accepted after 2016.

So yes, Froneman did say that, but the judgment is basically unenforceable due to the sheer size of the problem. I suppose its like flooding the SAP with pass law violations...

The only way out actually, is to do away with renewals entirely and go back to licenses for life.

Don't give an inch.

Ever.

[bodhi_]

Why do you think they want to change the property clause in the constitution: confiscation without paying

[Steven001]

AND while the Minister of Police speaks all this rubbish I got an sms today with ANOTHER approval, yaaay and EF you cele....

[WCC]

AND while the Minister of Police speaks all this rubbish I got an sms today with ANOTHER approval, yaaay and EF you cele....

Yes and enjoy it for now because once the amendments come it will likely not be renewed again. Which is the way I think this is going to play out. :(

[WCC]

Well GOSA does their work through the courtrooms, this issue will ONLY be won in court as it's an amendment we are against not cele himself.

The amendments will be passed as law whether we like it or not. At best we can delay the process from a legal perspective or even get some concessions, but there’s no denying that the government has done all but declared current legal FA owners criminals and it will be done with the stroke of a pen. They do not care that criminals have guns because they cannot and/or will not do anything about it - what they care about is having total command on violence and law abiding FA owners are standing in their way.

One thing this government understands is public protest and pressure. Problem is we as legal FA owners do not understand this - I would argue that the majority of FA owners will wait till it is too late to act by relying on the false hope that the courts will magically intervene in the legislature’s power to make laws. At the very least each one of us should support GOSA, not just because they can perhaps delay the inevitable in court, but because they provide the structure for a pro gun movement to change the status quo. We need to win the hearts and minds of society and push the pro gun agenda. This needs a concerted lobby effort by all gun owners.
Look what happened to eTolls when there was mass defiance. It doesn’t mean the problem goes away but you win the war battle by battle.

What I believe is coming is a Constitutional Court challenge on the means to protect the right to life. It will be an interesting debate but I think it will be a hard one to win given that the Constitutional Court judges have already given us a glimpse of their view on guns, which favour the anti gun proponents.

[Steven001]

Just remember, in order to disarm the armed, like the Nazis did with the Jews, you need systems that work, you will need a military that works and a police service that knows left from right.... beki cele will be put in his place!! We do need to stand together though more than ever!


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